/cyb/ - cyberpunk and cybersecurity

>>426

Luckily FB as a brand is going down, too much soykaf so its not trendy anymore

I have actually avoided FB in both social and work occasions by simply saying "who uses that anymore". Rather than look like a weirdo that doesn't have FB I make them look like late adopters who are using this decade's equivalent of AOL and that shuts them up for good

Of course YMMV

>>426
I fucking hate Facebook with a passion. And everything here is absolutely correct.

Well, I sadly do have an account. But I don't post anything personal at all there. I literally use it to message family members and friends that I otherwise wouldn't have any other way to contact as they don't get on anything else or would talk to me via e-mail.

Biggest tip I could give to anyone is if you choose to use it and want to remain something of yourself or have some sort of dignity. Either make a fake account or just DO NOT share anything personal or that'd be anything part of your privacy and most of all don't use it on your damn phone.

>>426
>>How Facebook's tentacles reach further than you think
This is the research referenced in the BBC article. It's worth having a look.
https://labs.rs/en/the-human-fabric-of-the-facebook-pyramid/

I like this interview because it treats Facebook as a social issue instead of a purely personal choice:
http://observer.com/2011/12/in-which-eben-moglen-like-legit-yells-at-me-for-being-on-facebook-2/

I've never used Facebook but I'm sure they have a quite complete shadow profile of me thanks to those around me who use it.

pff it's super easy, just make a place-holder facebook to keep in touch with IRL contacts you care about (if you care about that)
> you don't have to post anything
> you don't have to use a profile pic of your face
> you don't have to use it
> just message people when you need to get in contact with them
> don't even need to have a convo on messenger, if you want to talk outside of fb juts ask for phone number
> if you are so spooked that receiving your highschool ex-classmate phone# through messenger is too much then i don't really know what to tell you
> you can still check your IRLs profiles if you are curious enough

if you don't want to use fb that's seen as normal, you don't have to make up some faux-excuse like >>428
> "oh i don't like social media"

i personally have used facebook a lot, it allowed me to meet loads of new people, it turned into an addiction at some point, and eventually i just deactivated my fb but kept messenger and made a new fb with none of the brewing soykaf and only people i knew irl, and everything is in order.
> inb4 they have ur personal information
of course they do, im not dumb

adding to >>435

the real problem with facebook as an application (looking past the whole issue with privacy) is the newsfeed algorithm, it's super messed up and completely ruins what could possibly be a nice way of keeping in touch with other people by posts (imagine some kind of personal imageboard with your friends, that'd be sick), and turns it into this 'vice enabling' device, like most products of this virtueless vice-driven society.

>>433
This is really good stuff lain. But also terrifying if you think about it.

To be honest Facebook won't survive much longer because people just use Whatsapp or Telegram.

>>435

>faux-excuse
> "oh i don't like social media"

You completely missed the point chummer

Then again…

>i personally have used facebook a lot
>it turned into an addiction at some point

What are you 15?

>only people i knew irl, and everything is in order.

They can still track you that way

>>438

They OWN whatsapp and instagram, almost nobody uses telegram (this coming for a telegram user)

I only have an account for Tinder, under a fake name with all fake info. I never use it, yet it still recommends me people I knew in the past IRL as friends. It's unsettling.
I'll probably delete both tinder and the facebook account sometime, as tinder doesn't work in christian nations like the USA, unless you live on a university campus or in a huge city.
Anyone working for facebook is an unethical person not worth being around, for sure. Remember, the greatest pressure you can put on people is to reject them if they do bad work.

>>440
>almost nobody uses telegram (this coming for a telegram user)
No, all the fucking ``````nerds'''''''' use telegram
"Wow I thought you were smart anon… I thought you'd use telegram"
I hate it, it's so bad, it's so soykaf, but people keep fucking using it, and won't move to IRC or XMPP

i was recently required to join facebook for one of the organizations im now a part of. its undoubtedly the worst platform available on the internet today, but nobody seems to care about value of a service, so long as you can learn all about your friends use of the same serivice. the only thing it has going for it is user adoption. everyone uses facebook. and this is a very important "feature" for most people. unfortunately no other social network i am aware of has goals which include user adoption, and getting them to participate in the network, which is a huge problem.

>>436
as an average user you will receive over 1000+ notifications based on the things you subscribed to. do you think that everbody should have access to every piece of data on their newsfeed? this would significantly drop the user count and would make facebook less valuable. feeds either need to be hyper specific (think chat clients, or GNUsocial - which is a kin to twitter) or filtered for the user. evil newsfeed algorithms can have a significant effect on your day to day life, but newsfeed algorithms (whether good or bad) are not to blame, and in fact are necessary to providing you with the data that you are interested in. filtering and ordering of data is a necessary issue. however, being given the choice about how this ordering and filtering is done, can make this problem go away, although this obviously complicates the problem. how can we get everyone to care and then manage their own social news feeds based on their own interests? so far nobody/company has proved that there is a solution to this problem.

the problem with facebook is the normalization of the collection of all data created within it's system. nobody who understands how much data can be generated, and then stored and analyzed can talk about you, have no idea what the implications much be of such collection across the globe. imagine if you were privy to the communications of every human on the planet. what sort of power does that grant you?
i believe such amounts of data would render you a god and so the security of my data is not only my problem, but the problem of the greater state of humanity, which makes me all the more likely to not freely give away this information for convenience. this information is priceless, as it is a function of time.

>>434
wow, this article hits the nail on the head. its not about you. its not about whether you care about your own data and whether you're being spied on, its about the safety of freedom. technology is apathetic towards freedom. so long as you "allow" it technology will stamp all over your freedom. technology continues to grow at an exponential rate. a dystopia in which no freedom exists is an inevitable outcome of technology. all we can do is delay it.

were all fucked. go home. talk to the people that matter to you. tell your friends and loved ones youre sorry you let it come to this as someone intimately involved in technology it was your duty to communicate the intricacies of what was happening, but that its the fault of everybody who chose not to make a decision. inaction has consequences. we failed.

>>442
in comparison to whatsapp telegram holds but a candle. not to mention it provides no benefits. use signal/wire if you care about security/privacy, use matrix if you care about social software and the implications of a proprietory skynet. but then again, you already know this dont you lainon. the problem isnt us, its never us, its all those people who dont understand or dont care to understand.

>>440
this individual knows what hes saying. any facebook account is too many facebook accounts. any usage of facebook is too much usage of facebook. dont accept the normalization of surveillance. resist platforms that actively spy on and manipulate users in seriously harmful ways. be the change you wish to see in the world.

Dont need to quit facebook if you never had friends for it anyway haha

>>442

I use it for a couple groups and thats all

>>445

On a sidenote: Study links Facebook use to reduced gray matter volume in the nucleus accumbens

http://www.psypost.org/2017/05/study-links-facebook-use-reduced-gray-matter-volume-nucleus-accumbens-49028

So FB makes you addicted and depressed, or increases any existing addiction or depression until the point you actually damage your brain

Of course this has nothing to do with FB being deliberately engineered to create addiction and increase pageviews, nothing at all

Keep walking citizen, nothing to see here

Here's a short documentary on what it actually looks like in one of facebook's content moderation centers: https://vimeo.com/213152344

It came up in this episode of Listening Post on the ethics of moderation. Apparently more companies are contracting out their moderation, in order to reduce the chances they'll get sued for traumatizing the workers who do the work: http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/listeningpost/2017/05/facebook-ethics-moderation-170527074621452.html

Unrelated to all that, here's some info on Facebook's far off plans for brain-computer-interface stuff. The Intercept asks if it would be used for advertising, and Facebook is non-committal: https://theintercept.com/2017/05/22/facebook-wont-say-if-theyll-use-your-brain-activity-for-advertisements/

>>434
>that entire conversation from the article
Guilty as charged, and it stings how right he is. I'd hate to be on the wrong side of RMS even more than Mr. Moglen. I have an FB account to masturbate to pictures of old high school classmates. Might as well tell me to stop masturbating; it's futile. I had high school classmates who resisted the call of Facebook until after high school when they finally caved.
>>448
>The Moderators
They (almost) do it for free!

>>445
>be the change you wish to see in the world
This. If you submit to peer pressure, how can you expect people to take you seriously?

>tfw zuckerberg will be running for president in 2020

just what the world fucking needs. this autistic sociopath really thinks that he'll win, even though the majority of people in the country know that facebook is a cancer.

>>463
>even though the majority of people in the country know that facebook is a cancer.
The majority of people knew Trump and his ilk were cancer. This, even less so.

>>464
The majority of people in the US have either voted for him, not voted at all, or were not eligible to vote and were not asked the question in the first place, so you are factually incorrect.
Unless, of course, you assume that some part of his voters and people that did not make a choice thought that "he is cancer", but that was not the question asked in the elections, so it is purely speculative.
Are you trying to provoke a reaction from right wing people, or from people that are tired of political bullsoykaf?

>>467
if we want to get pedantic, >>464 is technically correct with the term "majority"" if that's implied to mean "majority of all the people in the US who voted for presidential candidates in the 2016 general election", as Trump did not win the popular vote. however, popular vote is irrelevant in US elections due to the electoral college.

disregarding any of that, i'm very afraid that the 2020 dem primary candidates will be Cory Booker, The Zucc, and (ugh) Chelsea Clinton. btw i'm just as tired of political BS as most everyone i know, as i can't believe how blind/deaf the supposedly "left" opposition party is to the desires and policies of true progressives. especially after Hillary's failure of a campaign.

>>463
The majority of people is still happily on facebook and will gladly vote for him because he's so "young" and "cool" and "not like those other old farts".

>>522

>as i can't believe how blind/deaf the supposedly "left" opposition party is to the desires and policies of true progressives. especially after Hillary's failure of a campaign.

I'm not American, but I am a leftist (more or less) who's in full agreement on this point. There is nothing "left" about the Democratic Party whatsoever. Obama's cabinet was full of Goldman Sachs insiders, and Clinton's expected cabinet picks were of that exact same wealthy crowd.

>>581
It could hardly be any other way. That which liberals refer to as a "liberal democratic republic" can never be anything other than, more than or less than a dictatorship of the capitalist class. Sometimes it's more obvious or less, and the capitalists in different countries will have different needs and wants. Trump's cabinet, for example, contains a few alt-right nutjobs to appease the voter base – but the real nasties to look out for are the clean cut rich ones and establishment neocons who push him into doing things like taking the FSA's side in Syria (how many of his voters wanted that???).

Having difficulties deleting my fb account since I use it to discover new music. It's just that, otherwise i would've already deleted it.

>>597
Bandcamp son

>>597
Like >>598 said bandcamp is good
Also – check out the music scene in your town, and patronize a club or hall. In addition you can always ask the lains – we have good taste in music!

> Too much Facebook causes 'virtual autism' claim experts
https://archive.fo/AuO2M
Spending too much time using Facebook could cause users to show signs of 'virtual autism' that has similar personality traits to those on the disorder spectrum, according to a study.

>>435
Facebook can request that you provide your identity to verify the legitimacy of your account. This is what they did to my dummy account, and now they're asking for a photo of my driver's license. Linkedin can ban you and ask for the same soykaf.

Only thing keeping me from deleting it is messenger, because thats how i communicate with my parents and like 2 friends. If i had a phone plan for my cellphone i could delete it since i would be texting, but i cant do that, and apps such as textplus and such dont cut it. Theyre most likely not going to start using the apps i want to use for privacy, so what should i do?

> >How Facebook's tentacles reach further than you think
I knew it already, so this line already decimated my interest in anything you can say. Consider your target audience before posting, and if you know it's fuarrking lainchan, please assume that yes, they know about facebook being a big bad boy.
> >Facebook’s Zuckerberg Says The Age of Privacy is Over
There Never Was Any Privacy, But Kids Our Age Wouldn't Know

Avoidance is a temporary tactic; thinking you can avoid it for a decade, or however many years you need to get that happy life of yours done is wishful thinking at best - and oh, the decade has already passed. At this point, you can't fight it alone or with acticism, slacktivism or hacktivism. You need sincere social effort, and what better face to find like-minded people than the capital of the enemy? Just make a facebook group about taking down facebook for good.

This post is constructive criticism and good humor for people with the capabilities to utilize either or both.

https://www.rt.com/news/416961-facebook-schrems-court-ruling/
Looks like Facebook might be in trouble for abusing EU data laws.

I've been on lainchan since June 2014, and I grew to hate the same facebook-hate topics more than facebook itself by this point. How do I stay productive in such a thread with the aforementioned condition?

>>428
(YOU) ARE A FUCKING GENIUS
Most of my irl friends aren't on facebook so they understand, but I've never known what to say to normal people at uni that want to add me.

>>2092
You speak like a cunt.

>>428
> that shuts them up for good
I think you misinterpret the reason they stop talking to you.

I just tell them "I've never used that".

I've deleted my facebook account in July 2017. I got tired of it, it consumed too much of my time and was absolutely worthless. 2 worst things about fb are the surveillance and profiling. Data mining is absolutely unethical and people who own companies that were proven to do it should be put in jail and their companies closed because it violates human rights. But there's something that's as bad as data mining if not worse - it's profiling. All of their algorithms that are responsible for showing you what you want too see create an informational bubble thus making people who are less resistant to manipulation think they're living in some kind of an amazing, colorful world filled with love and niceness. It also creates complexes since everything there is so awesome, people are happy and they love each other, which again might trick some people (especially young ones) into thinking this is the world we live in, and alienate them from reality because they would rather spend their time browsing those colorful, amazing and happy social media filled with interesting things than to participate IRL, 'cause honestly… why would they? Fuck facebook, fuck social media owned by corporations (and corporations themselves too), fuck profiling, data mining and all this soykaf. I have only one social media account and it's mastodon. Because it's ethical and doesn't cause any kind of addiction on purpose.

>"X will miss you"
Ironically, it was the account deactivation page which convinced me more than anything else that I needed to deactivate my account. Manipulation doesn't get much more overt than this.

Twitter version

Twitter's manipulation is more subtle. It's wrong for machines to make emotional appeals to humans to try to win in a conflict of interest.

>>2461
>>2460

It's a wonderful news. I recommend you to talk about the benefits of deleting social media to your entourage maybe you're going to be able to convince them to do the same.

people on here have/had facebook accounts ?
sheesh i expected better

>>2463
this is the site with a 200+ people discord channel, your expectactions should be rock bottom

https://kidsper.wordpress.com/2010/11/28/mark-zuckerbergs-livejournal-blog-post/

Zuck: Yeah so if you ever need info about anyone at Harvard
Zuck: Just ask
Zuck: I have over 4,000 emails, pictures, addresses, SNS
[Redacted Friend's Name]: What? How'd you manage that one?
Zuck: People just submitted it.
Zuck: I don't know why.
Zuck: They "trust me"
Zuck: Dumb fucks

>>2463
I think "had" is fine, it's not a bad thing to change your behavior as you learn new information.
"Have" is not so good.

Do you think the current scandal about "Cambridge Analytica" will change anything or will people just forget about it in a week or less?

>>2623
Users will forget about the scandal in a week or two, if they even know/care in the first place. Any lawsuits and legal action will continue for some time, but eventually grind to a halt and stop. Zuck will keep funneling money into his tax dodge "charity" but even if he didn't then the stock will rebound shortly.

What's the best way to hurt FB, social media companies, and megacorps in general?

>>2625
Stop using them / giving them your information.

Data is their nourishment.

>>2625
Convince as many of your friends to leave as well, spread information about how soykaf they are. Stop using all their services (yes that means instagram and whatsapp too). Find a group of hackers and bomb their data-centers (this is a joke I would never advocate violence against an oppressive megacorp which exists entirely to take away your freedom).

well i guess Facebook is done for

https://thehackernews.com/2018/03/facebook-cambridge-analytica.html

>>2637
People have been warning others about this sort of thing for years and it's barely scratched the paint on their hull. This will leave a slightly visible dent and otherwise leave them intact and functioning aas usual.

>>2640

It's facebook and others' whole stated business model. The weird thing about the story is how unremarkable it is. At least it gives us a way to talk with less concerned people about the dangers of trading your privacy for free webservices.

>>2643
Yeah. Some people who were dismissive of anti-FB sentiment in the past will probably say "oh so that's what they were talking about" and a few of them will disengage and start talking about the larger issue here (of which FB is only the biggest piece). I hope anyway.

Tfw I stopped using facebook in late 2010 So I was so lost when all of this happens

>>2637
I know a few people who use facebook regularly/semi regularly. Ive asked, and no one is dropping the service in droves, at least not among their groups, though perhaps things are going badly for that company, its principal value is its ubiquity–everyone is on facebook. It will only loose its draw when many people quit.

As far as I can see, theres a lot of fuss but that ubiquity isnt going anywhere.

>How do you avoid such a monolith like Facebook
You simply don't use it. I deleted my old account and made a new one with completely fake information (name, date of birth etc) just for the two people I know that don't use Telegram or Signal. If it weren't for them, I would've quit entirely. Joke's on them, I check that account maybe twice a month. I might delete it at some point but as of now, it's a good straw puppet for registering at other services. Quitting social media at some point becomes easy, kinda like quitting smoking. It's especially easy nowadays since Facebook, Twitter and YouTube seem to be dripping with hate and thier user base (at least in my social circle) becomes less active.

>What are Lains thoughts?
The concept itself might hold a lot of good for society but as with every invention, there is severe potential for it being abused or its range of usage blown out of proportion. What baffles me the most is how far people can take it and make "being FB friends" a personal thing in real life. When I quit FB for the first time, so many people I knew took offense from me deleting my account. I had to make up some idiotic excuse to justify myself. Another point is that social media has become such an enormous part of our lives that a good portion of society started treating it as some kind of human right. FB/Twitter/IG/WhatsApp/… did something wrong or has unethical business practices which has been known for years and people will go out of their way to try to make them cater to their needs (and experience shows that this is always in vain) instead of just not flipping using it.
Long story short: Stupid people use stupid services to do stupid things.

Not intending to highjack this thread, but https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8Dd5aVXLCc showing what's being done with the privacy sold, was scarry even though I'm pretty aware of the matters.

you don't escape it. Everyone uses it and it's essentially a socially acceptable drug. The only thing to do about social media is learn about it and use it to your advantage as best as possible. Try to find ways to use the dopaminergic effect and social need to your advantage or you know get famous and become a socialmediainfluencersupercoolamazingfortybillionayear.
You learn most by experience or necessity. Facebook is a loss, but twitter and instagram have better use cases for individuals. That's what I did. It actually worked. I don't know why exactly. Still figuring that out. Most people would kill themselves.